Forum for residents of St Georges Park and Long Leys Road Lincoln

[deb]

Since this may be ongoing I have started a new thread but for those new to this, this subject started under 'Development of remaining site...' Through the LLRA, Neil Murray, our labour councillor was contacted and he has passed this issue directly to Gillian Merron the labour MP.

[deb]

Reply received today from Gillian Merron:

"Mr Slavin tells me that although the Trust has no plans to build a medium secure unit, they are considering all of their current sites across the county in the context of their Estates Strategy. With respect to the future of the wider Long Leys Road site, the Chief Executive (Mr Slavin) points out that it has always been the Trust's intention to develop the site for health service provision and this intention has been communicated to the neighbouring site developers on numerous occasions. Mental health services have been provided here for many years and they currently have two in-patient facilities on the site: Long Leys Court (an assessment and treatment centre for people with learning disabilities) and Carholme Court, which provides rehabilitation service and both are likely to feature strongly in the Trust's future plans. Mr Slavin feels it is unfortunate that many residents in the new development seem to have been misinformed by the site developer regarding their future plans.

The Chief Executive would like to assure you that the trust will be keeping you, and the wider public and other stakeholders informed of any proposed development. It is his hope that by being open and keeping the public fully informed, they can encourage a spirit of community participation and understanding about mental health issues."

[Kay Rowntree]

Well chosen words by Mr Slavin! Most people would believe that this means no change to the current facilities. Development would infer more buildings being erected. I have been told that some of the current facilities are going to be refurbished and made more secure. Staff are temporarily being relocated whilst this is being done.

Does this man doubt the common sense of the residents around here?

Is there any come-back on the developers for withholding information? It doesn't bother me - these people have to be treated somewhere - and people forget - anyone can develop mental health problems. If it was someone they loved, I don't think they would object to where they were being treated- as long as they were being treated! Some people may object to living near these facilities and should have been provided this information. Knowing the speed the NHS moves at, it is not a decision that has been made over-night!

[deb]

I said to our councillors:"I am hoping that there is no hiding behind words here as the rumour was more 'change of use' than 'building' or the somewhat ambiguous 'development'. We have had nurses tell us that the wards are being changed for this purpose, but if fences are erected I would see this as 'development' . I would like to trust that Mr Slavin, in his hope for community participation and keeping the public fully informed, is not trying to be 'clever'. I have not seen the letter sent to him nor his reply so of course this could be an interpretation of both our questions and Mr Slavin's reply."

If fences go up there is a blatant lie. Could the patients inside be 'Medium Secure' without fences? I'm with you Kay, I am not worried about the current mental status of the unit, I would be more concerned about any form of violent behaviour. Did you see the Echo and the chap in the bank? He was with two carers and still managed to hurt people and cause a right mess.

[deb]

I have today received a reply from Ms Merron re. further clarification of 'development'. She enclosed the letter from Mr Slavin so the direct quote is as follows:

'...the Trust is seeking to carry out some modifications to its rehabilitation unit, Carholme Court. This will involve some building work at Doddington Ward to convert rooms into single bedrooms and create new recreational and therapeutic areas. Although rehabilitation services have been provided there for several years, the unit was originally built as an older people's psychiatric facility and is not best suited for rehabilitation services in its current state and does not meet the necessary standards of privacy and dignity.

Once reopened, the ward will focus as a high dependency rehabilitation ward for people with challenging behaviours. It is eststimated that the building work will take around eight weeks to complete, and staff and patients will need to move out while the building modifications are undertaken.

The other ward at Carholme Court, Saxon Ward, will focus as a slow stream rehabilitation unit (for people requiring less intensive support).

Both of these units operate at a lower level within the spectrum of care which includes low and medium secure which are the type of facility that appears to be the cause for concern for your constituent.

...I would like to reassure Ms Lisseman that should the Estates Strategy result in proposals for further developments at the Long Leys Road site, the Trust will be keeping the public fully informed.'

I think this is saying that these units will be at a lower level than either low or medium security, medium secure being the initial cause for concern.

Mr Slavin has the details for the LLRA Chair so any further developments will be known to us.

[john shipton]

Today, after the first postal strike, I received last week's White List of Planning Applications sent to me from Pete Boswell.
An application has been submitted to Planning at Lincoln City Council from Lincolnshire NHS Shared Services based at Gervas House. off Long Leys Road. This was registered on 1st October 2007.
The location is Doddington Ward which is part of St Georges Hospital. The planning officer dealing with it is Mark Foster.
The proposal is...
Refurbishment of exising ward internally and externally to include replacement windows with toughened glass, double doors on north and south west elevations to become single doors and erection of timber fencing to create an enclosed garden area.
The application number is 2007/0702/F
Plans are available for inspection. To view the plans is by appointment. Telephone either 01522 873474 or 873731.

[deb]

The LLRA have a copy of this application - it is as posted on the lampost on Long Leys Road. Internal refurbishment and an outside garden area for Doddington Ward. Doddington Ward is in Carholme Court towards the front of Long Leys Road/Carram Way. This is NOTHING to do with the Medium Secure Unit. There are friends on the estate who are keeping us up to date on things at the hospital in case anything bypasses us. Worry not!

[deb]

Rumours are growing again re. this issue so I'll repost part of the letter we had from Mr Slavin, Chief Exec, Lincolnshire Partnership NHS Trust:

'...the Trust is seeking to carry out some modifications to its rehabilitation unit, Carholme Court. This will involve some building work at Doddington Ward to convert rooms into single bedrooms and create new recreational and therapeutic areas. Although rehabilitation services have been provided there for several years, the unit was originally built as an older people's psychiatric facility and is not best suited for rehabilitation services in its current state and does not meet the necessary standards of privacy and dignity.

Once reopened, the ward will focus as a high dependency rehabilitation ward for people with challenging behaviours. It is estimated that the building work will take around eight weeks to complete, and staff and patients will need to move out while the building modifications are undertaken.

The other ward at Carholme Court, Saxon Ward, will focus as a slow stream rehabilitation unit (for people requiring less intensive support).

Both of these units operate at a lower level within the spectrum of care which includes low and medium secure which are the type of facility that appears to be the cause for concern for your constituent. '


This ties in with the posting on one of the Long Leys' lamposts re a Planning Application and is happening just as Mr Slavin had said. Now no one asked me to go any further after I posted this, either privately or via the site but speculation is again being raised so I propose to write to Mr Slavin and ask him what in easy-probably-non-medical speak is:
Challenging Behaviour
Low secure
Medium secure
According to his letter we should not have anyone in the lower two categories in The Village and I will ask for this to be reiterated

I will post his reply.

Meanwhile John (eager bunny that he is!) is off hunting answers and will probably also let you know anything that comes back.

[iggy]

the contract for the building work has been awarded to the company i work for .
deb
i will see if i can find out what the work involves and let you know

[deb]

Interesting Ian - is this the Doddington Ward work or is it the bit of digging that is going on at the end of Benbow over the fence - or both? We know mostly what the Doddington Ward work is but the other has been shuffled about in for some considerable time and sources reckon they may just keep tampering with it to keep Planning Permission open that quite possibly went in before LLRA was formed. Any info is good - thanks!

[john shipton]

I have had a word with a contact who is employed at one of the NHS Trusts in the Nottingham area. Patients with mental health problems are supposed to have help in the community. But due to lack
of funding and not enough medical staff and support workers, this is failing. Patients in medium secure units are allowed out with either a support worker or workers. Before going out, patients are expected to take their medication. Patients are persuaded to remain with support workers and or with the main group. The problem is what to do if a patient wanders off, becomes aggressive or violent. If a patient disappears for an apparent reason or another, the police have to be called and informed. If a patient becomes violent, the support worker must report back immediately and/or inform the police if the patient becomes uncontrollable. My contact is concerned as to what is happening at the St Georges Hospital site, especially when a new housing estate is nearby. Also with the remaining hospital buildings and land which is subject to outline planning for further housing development. Legal searches in buying property either new or established nearby will not reveal the mental Health units that are on site at St Georges, or their category status of security.
From another contact in Lincolnshire, I have been told that patients and their support staff will be using Higson Road steps. Now categories and status of patients could be a mixture of what could be considered behavioural problems and this may include paedophiles, but under mental health law, not to be considered as a danger to the public.
It is known that one or the two units will have the overspill from Francis Willis Unit of the Peter Hodgkinson Centre and which is based at Lincoln County Hospital, sent there.
I don't think residents should panic because the LLRA needs to find out the true picture first from the appropriate NHS body and mangement involved who have endorsed the new category of useage.
What I do know from contacts from the Lincolnshire area is that the present rehab patients are being transfered to the southern part of Lincolnshire, Grantham being named.
I contacted yesterday the Area Health Authority base on Cross O'Cliiff Hill
for details and one of their officers who knows about the situation said either he or someone else will take this on board in providing details, by ringing me back later on in afternoon. I also requested a letter in writing giving specific details and information. The letter he said would be dealt with and I should receive something by the weekend. The return call has not been yet made. If no call is received by Friday afternoon, I will make a few more "rumbles in the jungle."

[iggy]

doddington ward more of an upgrade but stronger windows and no fence

[SteveW]

The NHS will have you believe these people are harmless. Yet according to an article in the Echo this week one former patient at the Hodgkinson Centre was arrested outside the Police Station on West Parade in the early hours of last Frday Morning after he had smashed 3 police cars and head butted the Duty Officer.

[deb]

He certainly had a thing for the police but he was also drunk, not just his 'normal' self. It's a difficult one, people have to be helped somewhere and if the authorities classify them as harmless can we argue with people that should know better than us even though we know they will make mistakes sometimes? The current patients have been spoken about on this site before but I'll post any reply from the NHS Shared Partnership and people can judge for themselves or at least be informed.

[john shipton]

It is becoming a sad state of affair regarding so-called care in the community. Too many people are slipping through the net. Former patients are not taking medication and turning their frustrations onto something else. Some are so deluded that they think they are someone or something else.
To rectify this, people have or do things to get attention and in a number of cases it affects the community they live and reside in.
What some are doing is to commit crime, get drunk or just murder folk who may cross their path.
The murder of a vicar called Father Paul Bennett by Geraint Evans who is a paranoid schizophrenic, is a typical example. This happened in a village, part of a town in South Wales.
He was not monitored by Social Services. The police could not do much until he committed a crime and he escaped the net by being discharged into care in the community which was negative, and from this, he was disrupted to one and all.
The result of his trial was he has now been sent to a secure mental hospital and will remian there indefinitely because the system had failed him and what the judge declared...he was a danger to society.
How many more are in this predicament1